How DOE Media Landed Their Agency on INC 5000’s Fastest Growing Companies List

From building businesses in their college dorm rooms to multi-million dollar business revenues. Get ready for an episode packed with inspiration, practical advice, and a glimpse into the minds of two dynamic entrepreneurs & marketing masterminds—Nick Raschke and Ramzey Nassar. Two of the three co-founders of one INC 5000’s fastest growing companies in the USA—DOE Media. 

In this candid conversation, Nick and Ramzey share the highs and lows of their entrepreneurial journeys. From the challenges they faced in the early days to their innovative approach to digital marketing, and how they stand out from the pack. 

We talk all about dominating and winning in business and their ambitious vision for the future, including their current focus on acquiring other agencies to compete with the largest players in the industry. 

Tune in!

• 01:49: Nick and Ramzey's stories
• 06:37: How did these challenges change your perspective?
• 15:11: Struggles with understanding priorities as an entrepreneur
• 18:44: When do you know whether to double down or cut back?
• 23:47: What's your routine to keep a high performance?
• 31:38: What do you do to stay on top of the market?
• 36:45: Thoughts on adding value
• 42:58: If you lost everything, what would you do to get back on top?
• 46:48: What does winning mean to you?

Connect with DOE Media

DOE media: https://www.doe.media/ 
DOE media's Instagram: @doe.media
Ramzey’s Instagram: @ramzeynassar
Nick’s Instagram: @nick_raschke

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About The Hosts:

• Tim & Cindy Dodd are the Co-founders of PEMA.io, based out of Miami, FL. Connect with Tim and Cindy: Instagram

About PEMA.io:

• PEMA.io is a Inc 5000 Outbound Marketing Agency specializing in Enterprise Sales & Appointment Setting. With over 7-years and 1,000+ clients served in the industry, PEMA is the leading agency for cold outreach appointments & systems. Learn more about PEMA.io here: www.pema.io/discover

Chapters

• 1:49 Nick and Ramzey's stories
• 6:37 How did these challenges change your perspective?
• 15:11 Struggles with understanding priorities as an entrepreneur
• 18:44 When do you know whether to double down or cut back?
• 23:47 What's your routine to keep a high performance?
• 31:38 What do you do to stay on top of the market?
• 36:45 Thoughts on adding value
• 42:58 If you lost everything, what would you do to get back on top?
• 46:48 What does winning mean to you?

Transcript

Welcome to The Takeover with Tim and Cindy where we show you how to dominate every area of life and business.

Let's get winning. Welcome back to the takeover where we show you how to dominate every area of life in business I'm super pumped to have Nick and Ramsey here today because These two guys have built multiple companies exited multiple companies acquired multiple companies And they really just know how to market,

how to sell, how to build. And just if you are looking to build a company, sell a company, buy a company, or just want to have your current company be able to run and grow without you, which is super important if you're ever going to sell it,

these guys are going to know exactly how to do that. So guys, I'm super pumped to have you on the show. I know you guys made the Inc. 5000. You're going to make it again this year. I'm just really excited to have you guys on the show today.

- Yeah, really excited to be here. Thanks, Tim. - And Ramsey, you're my neighbor, man. Like you're, I got the same motion view, man. You're just a few blocks up for me, man. - Yeah, we got to link up in person in real life sometime.

- I agree, man. I agree soon. And then-- - That's where the best networking is, right? - It is, man. I just love, I love hanging out with entrepreneurs. I mean, there's, it's, you just, when you're like going through all the thick of it and your head's down and you're just like,

man, you feel a little crazy and then you go hang out with some other entrepreneurs. You're like, Oh, I like these guys. I like these guys. Let's not talk about me. I'm excited to talk about you guys. Maybe just give a little bit of your background,

like for what kind of led you up to what you're doing right now. Yeah, I can start that. So I'm a serial entrepreneur. I'm a technologist, more so by trade turned marketer.

And I've worked only for myself since I started out of college where I met Nick shortly after that. So yeah, I built several technology platforms going after B2B merchants that have,

for example, Shopify applications and APIs and really know how to sell and market from guerrilla warfare tactics all the way to precision marketing from a digital funnel And I do it's I think it's so important to know how to just get in there and grill a market like You can have all just to be able to just get in there and then do what it takes man.

So I love that. Yeah Yeah, and my background is pretty similar to ramsey and my other partner jacob's I've been a serial entrepreneur since I was 16 in college I started one of the one of the one of the largest used paintball platforms called crooked edge paintball And then I connected all the different Factures to it and did drop shipping before Shopify was a thing before drop shipping was even a thing You know and

built that in my dorm room sold that after college when worked at a couple companies couple agencies and Help grew them, you know worked on got to work on companies like hello fresh movement watches and Movado and Got to grew them to over a hundred million and you know I actually interned for Ramsey in college when I was building my company because Ramsey was building thread me up out of his dorm that he took to

over 16 million as well. And so I was selling t -shirts with Ramsey and then later on me and Ramsey linked up because I wanted him to work on a company that I was working on and he showed me what he was working on which ended up being dough media with Jacob and I said,

"Hey, I'm your missing piece here. I know how to come in and scale some brands." I came in for the first three months, scaled one of their brands called Memes for Jesus, and it was just off to the races. I love that,

man. I love that. I mean, for I kind of want to just get right into it. Like one of my favorite things to know is just we know that entrepreneurship is there's so many difficulties.

Like you just stole this quick story and it's like highlight, highlight, highlight. Cool. Cool. But like we know that entrepreneurial journey is mostly like challenges. Like every day we're either solving a problem or we're like dealing with like some crazy stuff.

And I think entrepreneurship is really about like being able to push through those problem solve. What are some of the biggest difficulties that like the most difficult times you guys faced? And what are like some of the biggest lessons you learned?

- I'm all about sharing shared experiences. And like you said, everyone, you know, boasts about the accolades and the milestones, the dubs, if you will,

but the reality is 80 % of it is not winning. And you have to fail in order to win. And, you know, obviously there's a cliche saying that says you fall seven times and get up eight. And my brief short experiences,

I took a company out of my college dorm room to over 16 million in revenue, bootstrapped, and it ended up going bankrupt for multiple reasons. So at the highest of highs.

I'm winning. I'm hiring people. I'm employing folks. I'm being mentored by the CTO of Grubhub, you know, being liaisoned and advised by the former founder and the founding group of Groupon and Lightbank,

the Vector Capital Fund, and Redbox and all these big names. And they're shedding light to this young, ambitious entrepreneur that really doesn't know what he's doing. It's his first time. And when you get those types of revenues through guerrilla marketing tactics and just straight persistence and you misallocate them where the investments are going and you don't have a slush fund behind you for a rainy day,

it's a very tumultuous roller coaster to ride. And I think there's a much deeper story that we can unpack there, but That's my first rodeo at failure. But that failure ended up turning into several wins,

several exits from a fashion technology company that's now called Swagify .com to Nick and I built and sold a retail brand called SoilandClay .com.

And we're being contracted and consulted both equitably and for fees by private equity funds because we have those scars in our entrepreneurial records.

So I would prefer to work with someone who's been there and been battered and bruised than someone that just has won because you find more perspective in your L's than your W's.

I think let me ask something on that Ramsey and that's, man, I mean, what was the perspective shift? 'Cause see, I mean, anybody listen to this,

I mean, 16 million, you know, you're young or, I mean, you're probably thinking like, dude, we are going to the top with this thing. Then you misallocate some different problems happen. You go bankrupt on this.

What was your biggest lesson that you learned to that you would attribute to the success in the next businesses that you built. - I mean, the easy one that comes top of mind is persistence, you know,

when you're thinking you're doing 30 million in the next year, and actually you do half of what you did in that previous year, fucking shit sets itself into perspective right away and very quickly.

- Yeah. - And so I think just tenacity and persistence and not giving up and being able to pivot on a dime and call audibles is the biggest take away that I've had that's resonated in what Nick and I and Jacob are doing at Doe as well.

And other ventures we're involved with. Additionally, understanding how to work what's called negative working capital cycles to your advantage versus your detriment is a big kind of financial modeling exercise that I've learned in playing musical chairs with money,

if you will. You know, I know exactly what you're talking about, but just in case anybody listening doesn't know, of course, I don't know what you're, I don't know what that means. I'm just kidding. What does that mean? Give me,

like in a 30 seconds, what is that? What does that mean? Very simply, like if you're running a business that has products, you have costs of goods and you have supply lines and vendor terms and contract terms and all that stuff.

You can use those net 60 days and net 90 days to reinvest it into growth. But if you miss the mark, then you miss the mark on your sales growth and your overhead of your employment staff and you owe your suppliers still.

So it can work to your advantage, but it could work to your detriment if you do not fiscally forecast and manage it properly and short.

So it sounds like you're just freaking hungry and you grew it. And a part of that is why you were able to grow so fast because you were willing to take the risk. You were willing to double down. You're willing to move. But then you kind of were like educated,

okay, then there needs to be that aggression, but there also needs to be like a plan, a plan for when things don't go ideally. And ideally and 80 % of the time you're failing,

I'm like, man, I don't know what your secret is. But I mean, the other thing is, is you have to have a yin to your yang. A lot of people don't like business partners,

but man, it can I linked up. I mean, we are poor opposites in areas, but we are, we are magnets in other areas like that. We yin to each other's yang and truly the word the terminology like friction creates diamonds is like epitome of our relationship because I'm so out there and I'm so aggressive and You need to have that other side of you that can kind of balance and be like dude like let's be pragmatic Let's

let's let's not be as optimistic about this or this and So I guess with that, I'll segue to Nick to share his learning lessons, but holistically like learning from my failure,

my biggest failure and turning that into a lot of wins. You have to have the right team behind you and you ain't, you're nothing without the right team, both from an executive leadership business partner perspective,

all the way down to the actual, you know, management team and internal structures that, that are built. Yeah. I, I 1000 % agree. Like I,

I, I just did some content on like no, no one's self -made man. There's no great business that was self -made. There's no great boxer, athlete, self -made, it's teammate, man. And I love, I love how you brought that in because it's like,

you're never going to grow beyond, beyond your team. And, and your team is never going to grow beyond your own, like your own leadership. So I'd love to hear from you, Nick, are, are you a little bit more, I'd love to hear like the difficulties you've gone through where I kind of want to hear a little bit of that.

Are you a little bit more like methodical in the way you think out before taking, like before attacking, you're like, let's look at all the different possible ways that you can go plan. Okay. If it does go,

if the shit hits the fan, what are we going to do there? What's the worst case scenario? Like what is kind of your thinking on that? And then I'd love to hear one of your biggest failures. - Yeah,

that's pretty much how my mind works. There's pros and cons to that. I would say I pretty much think through every type of scenario that could possibly happen and that can create other anxiety for other people,

but for me, it creates comfort because I'm like, oh, okay, once we're in any of these situations, this is what we do, having a contingency plan if things go south or if things go good, okay, well, what are we gonna do to sustain that growth,

right? I'm like I'm constantly thinking through that and sometimes I share ideas Maybe too early with Ramsey and them and they they don't they don't love that because it gives them anxiety But you know,

so that's even a learning lesson there is like, you know having to plan everything out But only sharing those plans when it's appropriate so that you don't want to stifle their growth and understanding how to work with Individual personalities and what they focus on and I think that was also a learning lesson for me that I constantly think about is like,

okay, I don't want to burden my salespeople or burden Ramsey with certain things that are on my plate, because that's my deal. That's my, that's what I have to deal with. And he's got his own stuff to deal with.

And so I think that was a learning lesson that we're constantly always, always learning. And then, you know, a huge failure of mine, I would say there's probably two, one ended up being a win that could have been a failure,

but, and then I'll start with the first one. So let me ask you something on that last thing you said, Nick. So, you know, Cindy, my business partner, she's 100 % like, like the Nick of the business,

like operations, like wants to think everything. If we do this, what's it, and I'm very much like ready, fire, aim. I had built my, my first company to like 243 monthly retainer clients in like 18 months,

and it just totally crashed. Like it is totally crashed and she brought in that organization we would you say I don't know if you know the language What would you say that like Ramsey's more of the like visionary like wow like bill out and you're more the integrator like Let's think through all the processes and pieces to really make sure that like everything works out Yeah,

you know actually I think both of us are kind of that same thing Ramsey is definitely more of the visionary and where we're going But I do think that we share a lot of the visionary of like where the industry is going to So we kind of like actually we yin and yang on the visionary as well And then even on the opsides like you know Ramsey will bring up a lot of issues and I'll be like Okay,

let's go figure those out But sometimes Ramsey has good ideas and how to figure them out too So I would say even with our partner Jacob like all of us yin and yang to all of those things But still stay in our lane on like what we really need to focus on.

I love that, man. Yeah, I love that. It's also very hard to balance all the personalities and all of the ideas and not-- and still build one of the fastest growing companies in the United States.

Like, that is a recipe. It ain't bragging if it's true. It ain't bragging if it's true. It's a jigsaw puzzle, man. It's playing Tetris, literally. And sometimes someone's going to have a really good idea and you know,

there's there's always great ideas, but it's like, what do we want to focus on and what's going to get us to achieve our goals and sometimes we win and learn through those lessons, right? Yeah.

but you have the idea, you might lose on that one. But if you can marry the timing with the idea or the standard operating procedure at the appropriate time of when it's needed and you don't delay it by 90 days or six months,

that's when you can find those exponential growth levers in your businesses. - So just all I'm understanding you, right? It's like, there's a lot of awesome things you can do.

It's becoming really good at understanding where is like the highest leverage thing that I should do. What's the biggest opportunity I could do once you kind of identified that attacking that with speed versus delaying it.

So figuring out where you're, am I understanding what you're saying? - Yeah, yeah, I believe so basically. And it's attacking it with diligence and speed. And that's what like Nick and I's complimentary skillsets come into play for our business,

for example, is I will usually attack it with speed and be diligent, but I won't be as diligent and think of all the scenarios that can happen as a result of that investment or that lack there of investment.

Whether it's people, process, technology, marketing, et cetera. It's kind of that marriage and we're not perfect.

We definitely miss the mark a lot, but we also hit the mark a lot. So you just got to be able to deal with the ebb and the flow and keep the growth.

And it's just us. While we do have mentors that we look to and help us day in, day out, it's us. There's no board of advisors. There's no investors.

It's just us using what we know and we're always iterating and learning from that. I would say one major struggle was understanding priorities and where we want to go.

There is a problem with most entrepreneurs, which is that shiny ball syndrome, right? We always see a shiny ball and we want to run to into it. And perfect example of this is in 2020,

when the world was crumbling, you know, and no one knew if their business was going to die or survive, you know, or take off. You know, there was a, there was a good three weeks where we were kind of limbo,

like are all of our clients going to fire us, you know, and we were only a year and a half in, we had a team of five people. And, you know, it was like overnight, things just took off and at the same time we were still launching three other businesses while still maintaining dough media and Dough media took off we went from a team of five to twenty within I don't know six months While also launching those three

other companies. We didn't put those three other companies on pause We launched we invested in several local businesses and one of the biggest ones was soil and clay And so at the end of the day when me and Ramsey were done with all agency stuff for eight to ten hours every day We would drive an hour and a half to Hampshire,

Illinois to check on our farm To see how our other online plant business was doing during the pandemic and then driving all the way back to Chicago Like we've got film of like during snowstorms.

We're taking calls when we're on our way out there We have we literally have movies that the world will see soon and so we're trying to navigate all of that while still having three to four X growth on our agency.

And so I think the biggest learning lesson there is like even though we got an exit and we sold the company and it was it was successful. You know, we look back and we say if we had taken all the time that we had launched into those other ventures and we just doubled down on dough media media at that time,

even though we saw 3x growth, we probably could have saw six to 10x growth if we really were laser focused. And so I think that that is definitely like a lot of entrepreneurs have that same issue.

And even when we work with entrepreneurs, we share that same lesson like if you have something that's working, and you see a huge future on it, don't just launch other things and take your focus,

dump everything into that, and then put in a team and a process to run it for you. So if you still wanna do those other things, that business can run virtually by itself and you can still spend,

you know, a couple hours a week making sure it operates and then go and do the other things you wanna do if that's what you wanna do. But you cannot do both at the same time because one will suffer. - Yeah,

I 100 % agree. I mean, I think so many, So many broke entrepreneurs believe the myth of, I need to create multiple streams of income and they've got like three or four things that they're doing mediocre and they're not actually building one thing really,

really well. And I think what I love about what you said there is like, you know, it's like a light like there's, if you, if five of these lights pointing on me, but they're not gonna burn through my skin, but a laser is just,

it's focused light. Like it's very dense, it's focused and that can literally cut through metal. And so I love that when you're when you're able to double down and focus on something. What I'm curious about is on that is when do you know like when do you guys think about okay,

it's time to freaking double down laser focus, like put the blinders on shut these other things down and focus on this. And when is it time to let go of something because you know as entrepreneurs,

you can test something for a while and like you go okay, when do you cut when do you stop putting energy and attention on an area of your business, whether it's a sales and marketing channel,

it's like a product you're launching, it's a new venture you're trying to do. When do you know, when to keep doubling down laser focus and when do you guys think about like, oh, it's just time to cut this,

cut our losses and just move on to the next thing? 'Cause I feel like a lot of people either cut too soon and they don't stick with things long enough or they get so emotionally invested in the thing they spent time, money,

energy in, that they wait too long to cut it. Where do you guys see that when to cut and when to double down? I would say on the cut part,

you really have to understand the sunk cost fallacy, which is what you're explaining. Like, "Hey, I put all this into it. I'm all this time and emotion and money. It has to work." And it's really good to one get other people's perspectives that have been there and done that and scaled those things,

get their perspective so that you can have a more outside view, like the best way to see the picture is to step out of the frame and take a look at all of it. And so you have to understand like,

why is it failing and is there any success to it? And it's something else working. And if you're like, I've done everything, it's time to move on.

It's not working, that's when it's time. You don't want to get stuck into like, I have to make this work, right? But I think also when the double down, you also have to take the same approach of, let's take a step back,

let's understand the market. Where is the market heading, right? And we actually share the same thing with a lot of the partners that we work with, that want to double down and grow, there is a time and place.

You want to double down when it's healthy, And when all of the data says that you can double down, but if all of the data and the market says you can't double down, it's better to maintain and focus on profitability so that when all of the data says you should double down,

we'll get ready, get strapped and let's double down. It's a timing and an understanding of when to do that. I think what you're saying to outside the sunk cost fallacy,

because Nick always brings that up and it's 100 % accurate, It's a opportunity cost of time, which is the only non -renewable resource, right? So if we're putting our energy and splitting it across three ventures,

and we could have just made this venture, like we could have made an extra few million dollars in profit on this, our primary venture, I would have taken that bet had I known all the time.

But you don't know when you're in the moment and you're just getting something off the ground. You just launched this e -commerce venture and you're going to $20 ,000 to $30 ,000 a day profitably. Well,

what are you going to do at that point? You're going to probably see that one through, right? And yes, to some degree. But to Nick's point, it's like he, he often has the, the,

the wherewithal and the pragmatic lens to be like, Hey, like we should probably start considering like not investing time into this.

- Yes. - And at some point we have a team helping and all of that, but it's really that opportunity cost of timing the market is really what it is. And to Nick's point,

a lot of our brand partners that we work with, that we've worked with, with the venture capital funds, the private equity funds, with Dome Media partners, they sometimes want to force growth. And if you force growth,

there's a saying that's called growing, growing, gone. Have you heard of that? I don't, I experienced that. I just told you guys not too long, you know, back in 2018 to 2020,

going, growing, growing, gone very fast. So I did too, which is what my failure was that I articulated to you. And if, if, if, if you do not,

if you have the blinders on in total vision, you can miss opportunities. So you really have to time the market and feel the data and feel the intuition. Dude,

I think I think the biggest like if we were to kind of step back and just sum all this up, I'm really I love Marcus Aurelius. I don't know if he's got read any of his stuff. He's he's a Roman emperor back in like,

whatever. And he's a really big stoic philosopher. And there's this thing saying that is called cognitive dissonance. When you step outside of your problem and you kind of look at it from the outside,

'cause I think the biggest, either waiting too long to cut or like not doubling down is generally an emotional thing and it's not a logical thing.

So what I love about what you said, Nick, and what you guys are saying is like, you gotta just be able to take a second, step out, look at the data, and then go, what is my is my time best spent on this?

You know, should I be spending? Yes, there's opportunity in these three areas, but where should my time best be spent? Is this thing like, is it time to cut or is it time to double down? And I think the easiest lesson from that is just like,

you guys saying like, step back, take a breath, step back and look at it like you're not even, it's not your problem. Like almost like you're your own consultant looking at this situation and go,

you know, what, what can we, like, what's the best move? So that's, I mean, and you guys have been through some pretty high highs and some pretty low lows. And so, I mean, a lot of this stuff is learned in the trenches.

This isn't just a freaking business book you picked up. And it's like, yeah, it sounded good. So I'll figure I'd say it on the podcast with Tim, like this is stuff you guys have learned. Absolutely. Absolutely.

So what I'm Super curious about man is there's a couple of things I want to know one is one is really around like what are your routines like what is that routine what is what is that mindset how do you guys I'm a big fan of not just managing time but managing energy right because like they're I feel like there's only a certain amount of energy you're nervous when you're much your nervous system gets overloaded like

you start stressing out you can't do much what do you guys do I mean I hear you're grinding, you're, you're working, you're putting in the hours. What do you guys do? What does your routine look like? How do you sustain this high performance that you guys are sustaining?

Ramsey, I think you have the best, the best balance there. So I'm going to let you answer that. Nick, are you, are you, are you just like, are you just, well, it doesn't matter, man. I'll sleep when I'm dead. That's actually Ramsey.

I think, look, when I was a younger entrepreneur, like I definitely was that and I was red bull monster, pizza wings. Everyone sleeps in the office on the (beep) futon,

sleep on the fucking floor under the desk 'cause the light won't hit you like actually there's, yeah, that was me for sure. But then when I had high blood pressure or high triglycerides and was overweight,

I was like, whoa, I got a (beep) step back into reality. So Man, about what Nick, would you say, when we really started this company, when we really started this company,

maybe a year prior to it, like seven years ago, I (beep) changed everything about my life. 'Cause I said, if I'm not healthy, mentally, physically, and spiritually, I can't build a company to the pedigree that my team and my partners need me to be mentally available to do.

And so I'm very routine oriented, but not. So specifically, man, I am obsessed with hot yoga. I do it five times a week.

I ride my bike and I do cardio. I do private breath work once a week in meditate now. I do cold plunges. And I try to get out of the house and live the European lifestyle by walking every day.

- It's easy to do that in Miami, isn't it? You're around. - It's so much easier. I've looked at Chicago. When we started this, like three or four years ago, like a couple of years into starting this company, me and Nick looked at each other,

and we're freezing our off in downtown Chicago, walking to or through the train and like back home or wherever we were doing from our, we work at the time. And we looked at each other and we're like,

dude, winter is a fucking choice. And I was like, I told him and I went meant to what I said. I said, I will be out of here in three years, mark my words. - And I'm still stuck here in Chicago.

- But it's not out of there. It's like, move to a different culture and environment and entrepreneurial ecosystem where we grew. Now we run Purevita in Miami.

And a lot of brands around us like resonate with us because of who we are. But yeah, dude, I'm religious about my health now. What I eat. So I went like pescatarian primarily.

I mitigated dairy and take a lot. I juice and yeah, I don't know like, but to Nick's point, I also stay up working till three, four in the morning, like all the time.

And somehow I I have this like always has high energy. I don't know how he does it, but, but then I'm healthy. - Well, what about your sleep? I mean, if you're up till three, I mean, are you, are you doing six,

seven, eight hours a night? - Yeah, I probably get like six to eight hours a night. Sometimes not, but then I catch up on the weekend or whatever, but every quarter I'll take a trip too. Cause I,

I'm very firm and believer in thinking on the business, not in the business all the time. So like I'm, I'm very good at self reflection,

still getting better. But, but yeah, I mean, if you're not healthy, then I don't know how you can build wealth and also stay sane as an entrepreneur.

- You know, I like, I am a firm believer that like people that are, they're sacrificing their health or sleep and all that stuff. They're, they're succeeding despite bad habits. They're not succeeding because those.

And I think what's like, I, you know, when I was young, I was in my twenties, I had a seizure from sleep deprivation. Cause I was like, okay, if I can just get to six hours of sleep, I can get one extra hour and okay,

now if I can get to five hours of sleep and I was doing the math and the math made sense. And then after going through that and starting to do a lot of research on a neurology and a brain the way we work, it's like,

No, actually, the productivity you have in your time is super, super important. Even as owners of the business and leaders, the decisions we make have so much weight to them.

You think of a Jeff Bezos, one hour of his time could be 750 ,000 hours of production, so that one decision he makes has so much implication. I think his leaders,

being in a good state you know, and being well rested, having good, like it actually is super, super important. And I think that's one thing I used to just be a sleep deprivation was a would like a badge of honor for people.

And I'm glad that that's starting to shift where it's actually more about like, you know, Hey, how do I get the most out of my time? And then, you know, of course, there are people that are also just lazy and they don't put in the work.

So if I had to choose between not putting and and and being healthy and and not put it and being like grind it out and like maybe been unhealthy I'd still grind it out but luckily you can kind of do both and that's actually better for you both totally agree Nick also has like an interesting management work routine with especially in our business like industries I know there's always like the the Warren Buffets and

all the all the gurus that are like I wake up at 5 a .m. I take a cold plunge and then I do whatever I do, right? I have, for the past seven or eight years, had a block.

You cannot talk to me until 10 a .m. And even at that point, it has to be really important 'cause I wake up typically around 7 a .m. I'll get all my emails answered.

I'll do all of that stuff, shower, breakfast in between. I might take a little nap and then come right back to it. And then I'll probably just work throughout the day.

And then, you know, I've really brought work into like an aspect of my lifestyle. And so if I'm going out or doing anything, I will work in between travels,

right? Or if I'm gonna go, even if I'm gonna go fishing for the day, which me and Jacob love to do, I'm taking calls while I'm doing that. So I get to enjoy both aspects of life. And it's definitely not for everybody.

I actually enjoy what I do. So it's not like a stress to me. That's, if I can do both things that I enjoy and focus, then I'm happy. - So that's how Richard Branson is,

man. You got that Richard Branson. Like his kids always said, like he was just always working on something. And that's 'cause you love it. Man, that's really, I think what's key on that is just to hear like,

it's super important. There's not like that perfect day routine, right? There's, uh, and sometimes your routine can be a tool. Like for instance, when I'm like, I got a ton of high,

like just I got to work on this. I got to build this. I got stuff that doesn't involve people. I'm up at five AM. I usually work nonstop, just music on my head, but it's no one talking to me. It's my flow time four hours.

And I got like three, three days worth of work done. Boom. Then, Then I take a break and then I get into it, but like right now, most of what my activity is, I'm meeting people, I'm doing interviews,

I'm going to events. And so I'm now getting up around that seven. I do my workout first thing then so that I have that energy all day. And I think what's super important is like you said,

there's not like that perfect routine. It's really important to understand yourself, understand your biology, understand understand what makes you really successful and have a really good productive day.

I also believe that when you're in a flow state, don't let anyone pull you out of it. Don't let phone calls take you off. Don't let slacks take you out of it.

If we're flowing individually or collectively, don't bother us. Don't bother me. Like sometimes I ignore Nick's phone call where he's like,

dude, I got it called next six times Like I don't think you get it like this one hour is worth like a whole week right now because I was feeling Yeah, yeah, but and then and then I might be in a flow state.

I need to get this from Ramsey So sometimes they the intertwine, but yeah, so true man I literally I'm obsessed with this stuff. My Cindy and I are obsessed with this stuff.

So I could like, we got to hang out, we got to get together. And Nick, you got to fly down to Miami and we'll all hang out. But I could talk about this. Nick, Nick is a different. He's a beast here.

He comes in, he comes in. He's just like, oh my, he turned Spanish a little bit earlier. Do you know Spanish? A little bit. A little bit. Hablo un poco de español. I don't know.

I don't know. I know Elevator Spanish, man. That's all I know. Yeah. One of the yes, which was Gracias. Ramsey Spanish is on point. Really? I just say oh,

muy bien. That's me. That's me. Especially in Miami, man, and Florida, it's like, there's a whole other side of the market that you kind of have to like,

speak it to like, do business in it. What do you guys do to stay on top of the market and the technology? Where is it good to invest time in research and on the other side,

when's it kind of like, dude, you're spending too much time researching AI tools? What do you guys do to stay on top of it? I think it's good to understand where the market is going in the long term future so that you can plan to get there,

but if you live too much in the now and you're playing catch up for where the market already was and you didn't have the foresight for where it was going, you're just going to be constantly playing catch up and you'll always be behind.

We also like have access to data. Our company's named DOE, data over ego is one of the meanings. So we actually like look at data,

speak to investment funds, see where there's consolidation happening across different industries, even in our space, like marketing world,

like there's consolidation, right, which we'll probably segue into the mergers and acquisitions topic for what we're like, working on. But the thing is, is that like, if you don't talk to other CEOs and COOs and people that are in finance,

that are in the capital markets, in the debt equity, you know, world that are in that whole world. That's also where we get insight that kind of corroborates with our intuition and our own research and what we're seeing in the markets themselves.

- So a lot of that comes from the data, but a lot of it is also just having an effort going out, talking and meeting the right people and fostering those relationships.

- Yeah, like Nick built a relationship with a gentleman named Gordon Liao a long time ago, right? I mean, we could talk about that, but now he owns a lot of companies that were involved in food and beverage and and an apparel in some types of technology,

et cetera. But like we were just invited to a private summit in Puerto Rico with almost a billion dollars of revenue there and CEOs and CFOs and BMO,

Harris is there, lawyers, all types of financial institutions, et cetera. It's like 28 people. But if like you're not in that room, then how are you going to learn about what they're doing?

So we're just constantly, how do you guys, how do you guys get in those rooms? So are you, are you paying to go to events? Are you never paid for a single event ever? I'll let Nick,

Nick touch on that one, but I think, I think you, to really be successful without having to pay for access, you have to be a, a monster networker,

You have to constantly be providing value and constantly have that hunger to meet other people Even if they're not the most successful people even people that are working on stuff They know other people the more people you share your story with the more they're gonna be like Oh,

I'm gonna connect you with so -and -so. I'm gonna connect you with so -and -so I'll tell a really quick story on this because as Ramsay had mentioned it with Gordon Liao Gordon is someone that I mentioned who,

or who I met probably eight to nine years ago now when I was working on my second startup and I just knew that I had to meet him. I was going to events in Chicago.

I was talking to every single person and most of the events were complete duds, right? I was probably 22 years old and I met this guy, I told him what I did. He immediately was like,

"I'm going to connect you with this guy, Gordon, connected with Gordon, had a meeting with him for 15 minutes because it took six months to get the meeting, but I was persistent and kept forcing myself to get this meeting done,

had the meeting left, had made a great connection, and I always reached out to him every six months just to connect with him, 'cause he was working on stuff and I didn't figure out what I was gonna do yet,

but I knew I was gonna do something. And so, you know, flashed to when me and Ramsey started and Jacob started Doe Media, the first person I reached out to was Gordon. I think I can add value to one of your companies.

Can I have a shot at this? And even that took six months to do. And we ended up taking one of his companies and growing it from $13 to $60 million. And that's how we got our first big case study and broke into this industry in addition to other companies we've already worked on.

But like for Doe, that was like our first big win together. And now like Ramsey had mentioned, Flash to years later, we work on every company that he works on.

He introduces us to partners all the time and we're still helping grow all those companies. That's just one example. - Yeah. And so we're just trying to replicate that. That's our secret sauce.

There's nothing secret about it. We give value nothing expected in return until eventually, when the opportunity and timing makes sense, we get a phone call.

That's so I would love to hear, because I think a lot of because you hear that just give value, give value, give value. What does that mean to you guys? Because you guys are executing that well. When you say like,

yeah, like, and I believe that too, like, like, you know, I made some really, some really dope connections too. And my first question to them was like, how can I promote you? We've got a list, we've got different entrepreneurs that how can I promote you?

What are you doing right now to promote? So that I'm always trying to lead with like, Hey, how can I make a connection for you? How can I, who can I connect and connect you with? Hey, I got a, I got a hungry audience. What can I share?

And so that's kind of what I think of when I'm, when I'm adding value is like, what do I have in my resource to add value? What do you guys think about with adding value both now and before you had the resources you have now?

I think network is definitely huge, right? Opening up the network, like that's the first value that anyone can do. Like that's your, what is that? That's your Rolodex, right? And so,

like that's definitely the first piece of value. But the other one is like, Hey, If you ever need help for your business, or whatever you're great at,

if you ever need help with that, give me a call. I'm not going to charge you. I'm not going to do anything. I want to help you as a friend and provide that value. So anytime we're asked to join a call,

because there's a lot of private equity deals that will help them run through the entire company, we charge it a penny. We'll tell them everything that they're doing wrong. And like they need to make that acquisition.

And if they end up hiring us after they make that acquisition, awesome. If they don't, that's okay, because we don't need anything out of it. And it's also like the enjoyment, right?

Like people that are really good at something, they want to keep doing that at scale. And so I think that's other that you can provide values, anything that you are highly skilled in.

Yeah, I share that a lot. I share that. I think I think they're on the Rolodex point. It's like if you could just make an intro and that person hires someone or they make money as a result of your intro and you're just like,

yeah, dude, like it's all good, you know, and you don't expect anything because a lot of people expect something specifically from those those introductions. those introductions, whether it comes back from that specific person,

if you do that enough, it's gonna come back to you tenfold. And we have so many examples of that. And then like Nick said, it's just like, "Hey, shoot me a text if you need anything." And we always individually and collectively get hit up by venture funds,

by business owners, by friends, and they just want to pick our brain. Wow. And we might go for two, three hours and have that conversation with them when in reality we could have done something else with that time,

but it will come back. The world works like that. I'll add one more piece to that because I think it's also important to understand the difference between giving value and then like being abused for your knowledge,

which definitely does happen sometimes. And so it's like, hey, you keep having the same issues that I'm helping you with every one of them. Why don't we figure out a way to work together?

And so, you know, that's a conversation that I think also needs to happen because not everything is gonna be for free, you know, and you have your own business to run. And so like that's just interesting convos that everyone should be conscious of.

- If you feel that line is starting to be crossed And it's like, Hey, you know, like just so you know, like this is what we do, you know, if you want to work together, we can talk about that or make an intro like, Hey, look, I have provided a ton of value and I'm happy to keep doing it.

I think the best course of action for you to really maximize what you need is either to do X, Y and Z. And maybe that's an intro that you make for somebody else or your advice is, Hey, I think you need to hire this person.

And so your advice can, can also, You just want to also save your own mental energy and make sure you're providing the right amount of value because we've had people that,

I mean, we've had people that have come back to us for years that I know Ramsey has spent, there was one time Ramsey spent time with an entrepreneur in Miami area that he was failing with a print on demand business and Ramsey stayed up all night.

While he while succeeding with it until he got a gut punch. - And Ramsey stayed up all night for like two days helping this guy and then we never heard from him ever again.

It was so interesting. It was very, I don't know Ramsey what happened to that, but it's interesting. But like that's the type of stuff that we'll do. - We've done that several times. Like I literally went to this kid's condo and made him slash 20 % of his organization 'cause he was too emotional about it.

And I was like, dude, it's either you do this or you're not in existence anymore. And he just needed someone that has been down that roller coaster that came from a trusted friend to tell him that and walk him through it because he's never been through it before.

So yeah, I'm sure Nick, I totally forgot about that. There's so many of those cases. And I think more people should be willing to do that and help other entrepreneurs. So yeah,

probably get away millions of dollars of our time since we started this endeavor. Wow. Well, we built it. So funny, because, because you hear a lot of very successful people say the same thing.

But it's like, to actually do it means that you got to give some air time. Like a friend of mine, Trevor Short, He runs the NectarCup and he's connected with celebrities,

athletes, friends with billionaires. He knows so many people and he's very big on, I mean, he would go to just so many different places where wealthy and celebrities are hanging out and he literally just became that like the connector.

He's like, you got to stay away from being transactional. There's a time for transaction and there's a time for just connecting. How are you doing? How have you been? And, you know, he's invited us out to some pretty, some pretty baller events while we're in the room eating the CCOs of billion dollar companies and,

and all that. And, you know, it's just like such a good dude and such a, such a, and so it sounds like that it doesn't even have to be like, he's not doing any work for us. He's just like, Hey, I got this event.

You guys want to come. And he's always that connector. So I think anybody listening, like, what is the value could be. It could be as simple as being a connector. Another friend of mine, he's got an eight figure business of super well connected.

And every Wednesday, he spends a few hours to go, he looks through his whole network and goes, who can I connect with each other? Like, hey, Tim, I feel like, and I would get, I would get emails from him,

like, hey, Tim, I feel like you need to meet Brian or hey, Tim, I feel like you need to meet this. And so I think there's a lot of different ways to do it. And it sounds like you guys have executed on that super well. So,

so definitely like, you know, pat on the back for you guys 'cause that's not a short game you're playing. Like it's not, you're not, you're not trying to make money next month. Like you're playing that long game with those relationships.

- Yeah, 100%. - So what, what I'm super curious about, and you know, I have a couple more questions and that is, I ask everybody this question, by the way. So this is very like,

I just, and I get all kinds of different answers. And you guys, you too might have different answers, but you might have the same answer. And that is, we know like the most successful people could literally be high of high and then lose it all,

crashes, back down to zero and then, but then they end up building it up to as much or beyond where they're at. So here's the question and listen to the details so you understand. If you lost your business,

all your money, all of your connections and you had to start from scratch. No connections, no money, none of that. What would you do to get back to where you are right now as fast as possible?

I think I would cold DM everybody and say, "Hey, I'm kickass. This is what I've done. I can do it for you and I'll do it for free for 60 days." But after that and I kickass,

we're going to have to have a different conversation because what you can't take away from me is my knowledge and that's what makes me kick -ass marketer and that's how I would probably go about it.

There's a theme there because you've done that to get to where you're at. I would do it all again. I'd probably go after bigger companies. Yeah, you're not going after the mom and pop store and saying that you're gonna go after the big companies and do something like that.

Exactly. I feel similar to that. I mean I have had it all taken away from me after having it all. You know, I was a millionaire at like 22 years old, living, living the good life. So all I had was a fancy car,

no, but I had a fancy penthouse and fancy friends. And there's, there's some learning in that alone, right? Where people try to take advantage of you and you need to learn how to protect yourself in those environments when you're the dude or you're the person,

you're the go -to, like, so I would, - It's a whole different environment. And there's a whole, there's different landmines too. And those social environments that you're not aware of until you actually are,

have the money. And now all of a sudden these new weird people kind of slip in that you're like, I don't know if I should trust that guy. - It's not even like, it's not even the social environments. It's like smart people that want to work for you,

but it's like, that's forced, you're not, the timing doesn't make sense. We're not alive. But yet you want to help. So like, you'll give a little bit. But I would say,

similar to what Nick said, I think he was on point with that is like, I am the master of the cold outreach and cold DM. And I've gotten everyone that I've worked with that has meant something to me from probably a cold touch,

whether it's LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook message, direct mail, walking up to their office, it's like never underestimate the power of shooting your sh *t shot.

Bro, you're talking my language. We do like 5 million cold reach -outs a month. we've done over a hundred million, like, that's what we do, man. Like, that's what we do. So you're getting me excited.

So, I mean, that's what we do. Well, would you lead with, would you lead with value or would you just straight up cold, like, let's talk. I got something. Close them.

I would, I still have my knowledge, right? I still have my brain and all the experiences that I've accumulated. You didn't lose that. Yeah. I would split out of it all. I would lead with freemiums,

I would lead with call to actions that say, you know, I'll help you for free, I'll lead to, here's my accolades, I'll even be honest probably and tell them I failed miserably and I'm rebuilding myself back up,

give me a shot. I don't know what I would do, but I would definitely split test several projects and just topics and then hooks and CTAs.

- What I love about what you said there is, is I would tell people that I crashed and then I'm looking to build back up. There's so much trust that is built when you're just like, dude, here's what happened. My business crashed and I'm looking.

It's like, people are so scared to show their flaws and their weaknesses, but no one does that except for an honest person. And so being able to do that in and of it shows self like builds authenticity and trust super quick so I think that's I don't know if you do that intentionally but like I see that I'm like I know how much that helps honesty is the best policy man if you're just upfront and transparent people

are good until they're not yeah yeah there's a it's a mix it's a mixed world but you know I love it so what What I'm curious about is the takeover is all about winning in all areas of life and business.

What does winning mean to you? Take that first, Nick. Well, because there's different ways you can win. You can win in family. You can win in your career,

right? But I think to me, winning is being able to do what you love and live comfortably and free free of free of having to you know be a part of the system free of you know having to do something you don't love which makes you miserable in life you know being I think everybody probably wants like that financial freedom so they can do what they love but if you have financial freedom and you and you do what you

love like that I think that's That's winning for me. - Winning for me is I've always built things that change people's lives. And winning for me is changing people's lives.

Just fun to like holistically speaking. And as a byproduct of that, my life changes both fiscally and spiritually and emotionally. So if I were to like simplify it,

it's how many lives that I can change or influence, businesses, people, employees, friends, et cetera. And that's what gives me my fulfillment and money's cool and obviously I want a lot of it,

but that is the fundamental. Like if I can change millions of people's lives, ideally a hundred million people's life is my kind see that I want to leave,

then I would say that I did, I won fundamentally. I also think just having inner peace and not being controlled by anyone's timelines or situations.

Yeah, and just protecting your, your peace and what brings you fulfillment will allow you to achieve the greatest potential that you have. if you're really stringent on that.

So that's what winning is for me. - I love that. What was interesting for me, and I've actually never shared this before, is when I started out, I just wanted the Cardi B,

that money, right? But as you start to change lives and you start to impact, as you start to see, like, we have our team, like our employees, like, hitting their personal, professional, financial goals,

You do start to get more motivated by the impact on, on the other people. And so I didn't start out like that, but I, I would 100 % agree with you. Now it is like being able to impact people is at the end of the day,

it's super motivated. You could be dealing with a million fires, but like, boom, you see those, like you start hearing those client wins, you know, we got a wins channel in our Slack. So we see those client wins and man,

it is super rewarding. Well, I want to make sure The one other point that Nick and I discuss, and it's a core value of me as a human being that I have to say, is life is a meritocracy.

And if you truly understand what the word meritocracy means, where you are promoted by merit in essence, no matter what you do, whether it's launching a product, there's a million of the same products on Amazon and on Shopify stores.

How you position it, how you message it, how you market it, how you price it, is what cuts you from the rest, is what makes you unique. In our business,

brands and entrepreneurs that yin to our yang, that have a special fire and innovation and uniqueness about them, and they don't just believe that we may wave a magic wand and it wins,

there's a million jewelry brands. Why is one doing three million and one's doing 20. The entrepreneur is winning in the meritocracy. And so just like in our employee pool,

as we grow, it's really hard to hire people, right? And train them and get the right people. But the ones that truly care, that truly want themselves to win and the overarching organization to win are the ones that get promoted rapidly.

So I believe life is a meritocracy and business is a meritocracy. If you can navigate that, that is what winning is. Sick, man. I think what I've loved about this podcast is you guys just have a lot of wisdom on business.

This is not regurgitated stuff too. Too often people, they read the book, they watch the social media and they're like, they're just re -saying stuff other people are saying. And when you speak, when you This is,

you can fill the authenticity, you can fill the wisdom behind it, you could fill anybody listening to this, I would have come back and listen to this episode again. I mean, what you guys dropped today, the value ads that you guys gave today.

And I mean, we could freaking talk for three hours. I know Ramsey, you're down here in Miami, we're definitely gonna hang out. I don't know if you do cigars, but if you do, we're gonna start having cigars together. But just everybody come back and listen to this again.

I want to hear from you guys is what are you doing right now and you know who are you looking to connect with man like who could I what kind of businesses can I connect with you know what out of our audience who would you like to connect with what do you guys got going on who you're looking to connect with what are you looking to do right now so right now we're focused on really building dough media to be the

absolute best digital marketing firm out there and really compete with everyone like we want to, we want to compete at the Vayner level,

right? We want to compete and be the best that we can. - At the densely level. The hostile level. - At the densely level. That's where we're going. And so we're on a journey to find other entrepreneurs and agencies and firms that have our shared vision.

And right now we're focused on acquiring and merging agencies, creative agencies, anything within our realm, so that we can become a powerhouse together and just destroy everyone in the market while also being their competitor.

Well, I mean, it is, it is the takeover is dominate every area of life and business. So you guys are looking to dominate the space. We want to build that. We want to build that ecosystem, man. That's what it is.

We want to build an ecosystem of winners that want to win, that don't have the foresight or the resources to do it, so they join us and they still can build their vision within our ecosystem.

And so that's what we truly want to do. Like Nick said, just to give a little bit more specificity, a little plug here. We're looking for Amazon firms, we're looking for Creative firms, user -generated content influencer firms,

paid media firms, email and SMS marketing firms, website design and development firms. If you're doing one to five to $7 million a year in revenue and you are not negative and you have decent profit,

we want to talk to you. Hey, if you're negative, actually, I'll talk to you because we could probably turn that shit around real quick. We can. It might not be with you, TBD. But the other thing is,

is like, you know, we're always looking for brands and companies to help market for. So, you know, we're a full service marketing firm,

we're a Facebook meta preferred partner, a Google partner, a claveo platinum partner Shopify plus WordPress VIP. And So if you want to dominate your market,

you should probably work with us. Yeah. And profitably, if you want to dominate your market profitably and, and, and you want to actually have EBITDA then work with us. And we're agnostic,

obviously we'll work with e -commerce businesses, but you know, we work with multi -door franchises, health and wellness, financial technologies, software as a service, a lot of e -commerce from home goods,

apparel, fashion, food, pet, automotive, et cetera. So if you guys are looking to dominate, I think what is super cool is that you're that you guys partnered to do this.

You're looking for other agencies to work with to build to that. And I think too many times people are so focused on like, I got to, and we talked about this before the show. It's like, I've got a guard on my I've got to do everything my it's like you're if you're you cannot build a great company by yourself So if anybody listen to this if you have one of those businesses in that range definitely reach out to

Nick Ramsey Where can they reach you at where where's the best place to follow you guys and check out what you're doing? You just go to media .com. Don't media. Don't media you guys you guys got the calm.

I love it Doe media calm And also follow us on LinkedIn. I'm on Instagram Ramsey Nassar. Awesome. Great having you here Ramsey.

Great having you here and everybody listen. This is the takeover where we show you how to dominate in every area of life in business. Stay winning.